Sunday, March 15, 2020

Essay 1- Gautier (for Mar. 23 discussion)

This is what the group on Gautier's story, "Now We Will Be Happy" wrote:

C. Amina Gautier, "Now We Will Be Happy": What kind of narrator is there in the story? Through this method of narration, what are we able to learn (or not learn) that is important about Rosa, Pedro, and Yauba? What is the significance of the story's title?

1. Narrator - Third Person point of view
2. Rosa - Is in an physically and mentally abusive relationship with Pedro. Feels very disconnected from her Hispanic heritage.
    Pedro - Husband of Rosa, very dominant in their relationship. Uses his knowledge of their heritage to condescend to Rosa.
    Yauba - The other "Lover" of Rosa, more respectful than Pedro. Is often compared to Pedro in a positive way. Of Puerto Rican descent and used to serve the privileged.
3. The title is significant by coming together and forgetting all issues that is happening in each person's life. The title is a statement of letting go and allowing yourself to be happy. This can also be seen as Ironic because even though they had a moment of peace at the end of the day they still have to go back to their lives and face their problems again.

For discussion on Mar. 23, 2020:

TF:  You've given us a strong sense of the psychological dynamics involving Rosa, Pedro, and Yauba. I think that you've captured the essence of the story's title. And I would elaborate on what you're saying but adding that "now" can mean 2 things: "now but not necessarily later," and "from now on" (like "happily ever after").

Yes, it's a Hispanic heritage, but it's specifically Puerto Rican, and all of the major characters (Rosa, Pedro, Yauba) and the minor characters (Rosa's parents) share this particular heritage. Pay careful attention to what Yauba says to himself when the third person narrator presents Yauba's interior monologue near the bottom of the seventh paragraph of the story: "Thanks to the Jones Act, no Puerto Rican is an immigrant, a fact Jim always pretends not to know. He hates to pay him his due, give him his rights, treat him like the citizen he is." Think about the ironic history of Puerto Rico and the U.S., which "won" the island in the Spanish America War as a "colony," which then became a territory, making Puerto Ricans who live on the island and those who live in the mainland U.S. citizens, but as we know from the recent botching of disaster relief after Hurricane Maria in September 2017, Puerto Rico doesn't get the privileges of the mainland. (In fact, there's been a lot of debate on the island for decades about whether or not their people want it to become a state rather than a territory, and some want complete independence from the U.S.)

Note: If a student cannot attend during the class hours but give comments BEFORE the class, I will often post their comments in the body of a blog post, but once class starts, everyone will use the comments section.

You say that the story has a third-person narrator. But what kind of third-person narrator is it? Limited? Subjective? Omniscient? Or even free/indirect?  (Look at the glossary in the Writing and Literature Textbook.) An omniscient narrator can give us interior monologues for ALL major characters:  Is the narrator able to get into the minds of Yauba, Rosa, and Pedro with interior monologues? Or do you disagree with the idea that Pedro is a major character? If you think he IS a major character, does the narrator represent what's going on in his thoughts?

 Frances C.: The narrator gives a character’s thoughts and emotions as though they were reporting inner monologues as herself/himself within a text that otherwise uses a general third-person narrator (Rosa and Yauba only).  Therefore the narration is in the 3rd person free/indirect.
 Pedro is not a major character, he is a contributing factor (Foil character) towards the Rosa and Yauba plot. If The narrator does not depict what is occuring inside Pedro’s thoughts, he is subjectively depicted through Rosa’s point of view… biased. 

TF: OK, but if Pedro is NOT a major character, then is the story third person omniscient, because ALL major characters are covered by inner monologues that seem to come from them? I'm really asking this question; it's not rhetorical, because I'm not sure what a scholar in narrative theory--which is not my specialty--would say. So I think students can make decent arguments on both sides: third person omniscient or third person free/indirect.

TF:  In this story, are there 3 plots: Rosa's (with Pedro and her parents) and Yauba's (in his job) separately and Rosa and Yauba's together? Or is there a main plot (Rosa/Yauba) with 2 less important sub-plots?

TF:  Are there any flashbacks that help us understand some of the characters' circumstances?

Frances: Yes. Rosa’s past and present is filled with emotional neglect and dissonance from her parents, more so with Rosa’s mother rather than her father.   During Rosa’s childhood, her parents purposely deprived her of a wide range of Puerto Rican cultural immersion stemming from music, to language as well as culinary techniques.

Yauba’s flashback enables us to understand his appreciation of simple and humble women, living quarters and the love of cooking.  

TF:  Does dialogue add to what we learn about the conflicts in the story from the interior monologues?

Frances: Yes, it adds subliminal layers to the conflicts.

Are the last few paragraphs of the story a climax or a resolution or both a climax and a resolution?

Frances C.:  The idea of “now” signifies  the climax of Rosa and Yauba’s discretely revealing their true love towards each other from here on which occurred  at the end of the story. Climax is reached during the last few paragraphs of the story, yet a resolution has yet to come.  Rosa and Yauba are in a state of temporary elation come the end of the story.

SUMMARY OF 3/23/20 DISCUSSION

The discussion was too complex to provide a summary that does full justice to it, so I recommend that you read the actual comments and replies in the comments section, and this may help you focus your own interpretation of the story if you choose to write about it in Essay 1. But what I can do is provide some general areas in which class members had various views:

1. Some believe that there is a third-person subjective narrator because we get into the minds of two major characters, Rosa and Yauba, but not Pedro. A small number, perhaps only one person, maintain that all the characters are important, and therefore, we have a third-person omniscient narrator. Some consider this a third-person limited narrator because they think that we can only get into the mind of Rosa, not Yauba; I cautioned these interpreters to be careful about asserting that there is no interior monologue for Yauba. Finally, some consider the narrator to be free/indirect, and this pertains to  Rosa and Yauba seeming to directly relay their thoughts to the readers, but the issue arose as to whether this was really happening. (Also, see my uncertain reply to Frances about 30 lines above this.)
Remember that, when you write your paper, the identification of the narrator and the support for this identification is probably going to take up 1-3 sentences for each story; it's not going to be a large part of the paper. We just want to know the impact that a narrative point of view has on the development of this story's theme in relation to how point of view affects the other story.

2.  Some contributors to the discussion say that there were 3 equal plots, because these plots were interdependent and interlocking, but some claim that the Rosa/Yauba plot is the main focus and that the other 2 were subplots.
In writing the paper, this will not necessarily come up, but if you can  relate it to the overall theme, you might discuss it, if there's a link with the other story you're comparing/contrasting it to.

3. There is general agreement that flashbacks are important to give background information about Rosa's conflict with Pedro, her relationship with her parents that influences her present circumstances, her inner conflict, her relationship with Yauba (to a lesser extent, since a lot of that happens in the narrative present of the story), and Yauba's conflict at his job.
Mentioning flashbacks can come up naturally (not in a forced way) in the essay when you are discussing a conflict in the story that is similar or different from a conflict in another story.

4. There is also agreement that dialogue is useful, especially because it underlines the positive relationship between Rosa and Yauba and also emphasizes points that come from the interior monologues.
Mentioning dialogue can come up naturally (not in a forced way) in the essay when you are discussing a conflict in the story that is similar or different from a conflict in another story.

5. Most contributors believe that the story's climax is at the end with the tub scene, where the love of Rosa and Yauba is fully confirmed and celebrated. Some consider Rosa and Yauba to have reached a full resolution embodied in their expression of commitment to each other, indicating that the resolution of the story can be in characters' minds rather than in some "final" action; some read the story's ending as a partial resolution, since we don't know if Rosa will leave Pedro, and some see this uncertainty or suspense as evidence that there is no resolution.
Similarities or differences in climax and or resolution between this and another story can be important to your essay.

  



51 comments:

  1. Q5) I think the last few paragraphs are both a resolution and climax. I first said a resolution because I feel like Rosa got clarity in what she really wants in life and who she wants to be with. I also say a climax because we as the readers are left in suspense with how her relationship with Pedro continues.

    Elvin Amankwah

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    1. These points make sense, Elvin. You disagree with Frances (who wrote on email, so I saw her interpretation first and put it on the "Gautier" post) on the resolution, and I think you both are clear about your main reason for this claim, so you can argue for it easily with details from the text.

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    2. To piggyback off of Elvin's comment, It’s both a climax and resolution because although this is a turning point in the story , it ends with the story matching the title. Everyone’s happy from rosas point of view because she’s leaving Pedro for her lover Yauba, Yauba has his goals , and her family can focus more on her dads health rather than her own complications.

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  2. After reading this story it seemed like there was one main plot that being Rosa's and Yauba's Relationship. The other subplots were just made to develop the characters and their background. An example of this would be when we learn how Yauba learned to cook and that he learned from his aunt and now wants to name a restaurant after her and that allures Rosa in more than she already was. Dialogue does help add to the conflicts in the story because through them we learn about the conflict in Rosas heart. I believe the last few paragraphs were both a climax and resolution because the story between Rosa and Yauba was resolved and they both sort of fell in love but its also a climax because we're unaware about what's going to happen between Rosa and Pedro

    Munir Haider

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    1. Munir, if it's a climax, then does it make sense to say that we're unaware about the future of Rosa and Pedro? Maybe it's a climax BECAUSE it is the strongest expression of their love, and a resolution of their love, but this climax does not tell us anything about their future; it's a climax to the story and not their lives. Does that make sense?

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    2. Oh yeah you're definitely right about that, that makes more sense. Thats a mistake on my part I see now that the climax is more relevant towards the main characters than the side characters

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  3. Good morning,

    I believe it’s Third person limited to Rosa and Yauba because it only gives insight on both their thoughts, feelings and perspectives. Although pedro weighs in on Rosa’s mental and physical abuse, he’s not a major character due to the lack of his thoughts, feelings and perspective.

    -Tiffani Thorne

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    1. Tiffani, third person limited is restricted to ONE character's interior monologue, and third person subjective could be 2. So far, you and Frances agree about Pedro, and you both give clear reasons.

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    3. Oh Okay,i see, thank you professor.

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  4. Good Morning,

    I believe the last few paragraphs are both the climax and resolution. The text gives almost a baptismal image of pain being washed away. This gives her a deeper sense of self and connection with Yauba. "When he is done and she is cleaner than she has ever been, he tells her the meanings of all the words she has ever wanted to know."

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    1. So by calling it a "baptismal image," Freddy, you're saying that this climax and resolution are conveyed not only by imagery but also symbolism (a trope). There is, therefore, in your view, a spiritual climax AND resolution, so you're arguing agains the idea that the lack of a resolution to the love triangle--whether they will really get away geographically from Pedro--is not central to the emotional core of the story.

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    2. For me, yes. I see the impact of this moment speaks more volume that confirmation of Rosa leaving Pedro. It is the moment of realization that happiness is possible.

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  5. GOOD MORNING,

    I think is a Limited Third person too, because the narrator only seems to know Rosa's inner thoughts. For me, the last few paragraphs are both climax and resolution because we don't know whether Rosa finally had the courage to leave Pedro or not, but we do know that her relationship with Yauba improve amazingly.

    Gabriela Diaz Abreu

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    1. Also, my interpretation was that Pedro use the fact that Rosa didn't speak Spanish to take advantage of her. She felt left out first by her parents and then by Pedro, but with Yauba someone who explain to her, teaches her, her heritage and doesn't judge her, is like she can finally found someone who she could rely to and trust.

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    2. Gabriela, in the fifth paragraph, we see the phrase: "Yauba reminds himself...." Does that change your view? I like what you put about climax and resolution because it clearly and strongly reinforces the idea that a resolution in a story can be temporary and not beyond the time frame of the story. But the question for everyone is: is the resolution partial or complete? (I think that may be what Frances was driving at.)

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    3. I agree with France about the resolution. The resolution could be partial, because we don't know the decision Rosa will make regarding Pedro, so certainly their happy moment might not last too long.

      Now, about the third person narrator, is the third person omniscient, then??, even though Yauba's thoughts were narrated just a few times? or the fact that we don't know Pedro's or Rosa's mom's thoughts??

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  6. Yes the dialogue adds to our knowledge on conflicts because it can assist readers in acquiring the tone of the passage. Although Rosa and Yauba have no conflict with one another , they are facing individual battles in their lives. Two person v person conflicts are 1. Pedro vs. Rosa (their domestic relationship), 2. Yauba vs. Jim (their work relationship). Although Yauba looks on the bright side of his conflict with him being a future restaurant owner, Rosa feels as if she’s a burden to those she seeks knowledge from. This can result in person vs. self conflict due to her feeling insecure, useless and/or hopeless

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    1. I think that your connection of dialogue and tone are important. Also, Tiffani, if you choose to write about this story for essay 1, Rosa's INTERNAL conflict might be a very good subject to discuss in at least one body paragraph. This internal conflict may be as or almost as important as the Rosa vs. Pedro struggle.

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  7. I would agree more of it being 3 plots rather than one with two less important subplots because the “plot is the foundation of a story in which characters and the settings are built around”. With this definition of plot, Yauba, Rosa, Pedro and Rosa’s family all play a part in both their relationships and culinary lives.

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  8. Yes the flashbacks help because without knowing about Yauba’s job suspension, him not expressing his anger around Rosa wouldn’t have been mentioned. Also Rosa’s minimum domestic flashbacks, as well as those with her fathers kidney disease, shows why Rosa feels as if she’s a bother to the ones she love.

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  9. The author tells the story from a limited third person point of view, using sensory details, such as imagery to describe the food to the reader, "their golden edges blackening before she remembers them." The use of the word "she" implies that the narrator is not the one speaking. The continued use of "she'd" past tense to refer to the main character in the first two paragraphs is further proof of this. It is only when the narrator names the character, Rosa, does the narrator then refer to her by her name instead of "she" by doing this, the limited third person point of view is established. The rest of the story continues to be told from this perspective.
    -Brittany Rosendo

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    1. Brittany,
      See my earlier comment to Gabriela about Yauba in paragraph 5. It may change your sense that it's third person limited. But this is not restricted to paragraph 5; you might find it later. You raise the issue of how it is established that we are getting into a character's mind (interior monologue). Well, there are a few ways. Paragraph one: "She gives the oil... knowing too well." If the third person narrator knows that Rosa knows and says it, then that's a kind of interior monologue. But also, the narrator can actually reproduce the exact words within a character's thoughts, even if we're not sure that that's happening: paragraph 8 has the sentence: "It will be nothing like this dining hall." We can imagine that Yauba is saying exactly that in his mind. In third-person free/indirect mode, Yauba would be saying "I" in his mind: "I know it will be nothing like this dining hall." This is complicated, huh?

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  10. Good Morning,

    I understand on what said about the story being either omniscient or free/indirect. I also understand and agree with what Frances was stating on how it was free/indirect because of Rosa and Yauba love story plot it will have to involve more of what is going on inside their minds.

    Giselle J Bravo Hernandez

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    1. Giselle, if you and Frances want to make the free/direct argument, you'll need to I Q A (introduce/quote/analyze) a few passages where it's really clear that the actual words of a character's mind are being transcribed, and not a paraphrase.

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  11. I believe this is a Third Person Subjective narrative as it describes flashbacks and thought processes of both Rosa and Yauba, and the plot revolves mainly around those two with sub-plots of Celina and Pedro furthering their story. I feel like the story both climaxes and resolves at the end, being true to it's name "Now We Will Be Happy", because despite having to go back and live their normal lives and face their ongoing problems, they have a new outlook on life and to the future; Rosa has her future with Yauba to look towards and Yauba can realize his vision of his restaurant back home with her. They find comfort in each other, with Rosa knowing she can trust him (evidenced by the small detail in the second to last paragraph where it says that he touched her "without lewdness") and Yauba having someone to confide in.

    ~Tijade Reynolds

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    1. TJ, your idea of "a new outlook" is significant, because it supports the idea that a resolution can be in the mind of characters and not just an actual event in the plot--like Rosa and Yauba running away to Puerto Rico and leaving that jerk Pedro to fend for himself!

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  12. Q1. Even though it’s third person point of view, You can see the personalities of every character there, but from what I’m reading it shows from Rosa’s life. Therefore she’s the major character.
    Q2. The main plot (maybe I’m wrong) are all three plots combine. I’m saying this because since no one is really telling the story (3rd person POV), all the characters have a important role in this story. They also compliment each other meaning Rosa,Yauba,and Pedro contribute to the story and one another.
    Q3. Yes, Rosa comes from a Hispanic culture, but does not know anything about it. She doesn’t know how to speak the language and what comes from the culture since she’s married to Pedro. Because of her past, her husband abuses her physically and emotionally for not knowing who she is as a Hispanic women.
    Q4. The dialogue does add to what we learn about the conflicts in the story from the interior monologues because while one thing is happening another situation another connects with it leading to what happens at the end of the story.
    Q5. The last few paragraphs of the story are both a resolution and a climax. We see what happens in Rosa’s life with Pedro and Yauba, but we also see what happens after. One of the paragraphs Rosa states at one point of their day, they all come together and forget about what happened before (Pedro abusing Rosa, and the love between Rosa and Yabua). You can also see at the end Rosa is more at ease and comfortable with Yauba because he treats her gently and respectfully. You can tell who Rosa loves more (she makes food for Yauba while he plays for her), but doesn’t leave Pedro at all. Even though Pedro is her husband, he’s not a good person in Rosa’s life and she does not leave him.

    Edona Berisha

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    1. Edona, I think you can easily support the idea that Rosa is the major character, and others that Rosa and Yauba are both major characters. In the paper, you won't necessarily have to make the distinction.
      You can also support the idea that it's all 3 plots combined due to the complementary or interlocking nature of those plots.
      Regarding question 5, I believe that what you are saying is that even thought Rosa does not leave Pedro, there is a resolution involving the bond of Rosa and Yauba.

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    2. Yes, that was my point. The resolution is the love bond between Rosa and Yauba. The way Yauba treats Rosa is the complete opposite of how Pedro treats her, but she never leaves him and I think it is because of her culture (not ok to divorce ).

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  13. Good Morning

    I agree on the author having his plot be a third person subjective. We hear both inner thoughts & perspectives on both Rosa and Yauba but don’t on Pedro due to the story not including his perspective on how he sees things. On top of that the story is very free/indirect because rather hearing what is going on verbally between characters, we see their inner thoughts mostly & how they view the situation in their head.

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    1. Darry, in the paper itself, if you write on this story, you're going to have to choose between third person subjective and third person free/indirect. You can't say it's both, even if you have good reasons. I should add that in the paper itself, the identification of the POV would be in one sentence and the support would be in a few more sentences; the whole thing for a particular story would be restricted to one paragraph.

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    2. Okay Professor. I thought we had to speak on both so I did. But if thats the case I'll choose and speak on one.

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  14. I think the story left us in suspense with how the relationship between Rosa and Pedro continues.

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    1. Ethiel, everyone would have to agree with you that we are in suspense about whether Rosa and Yauba can escape from Pedro, and the issue is whether we have no resolution, a partial resolution, or a psychological resolution.

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  15. Good Morning,

    I agree that the narration is third person indirect. The chemistry between Rosa and Pedro is still a little rocky for me. I agree with Ethiel that the story left us in suspense.

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  17. i think the story leaves a suspenseful question on wether pedro and rosa continue to have their relationship

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    1. Annie, it seems you may also be implying, regarding this suspense, that Rosa would have to be the one to leave the relationship with Pedro by going off with Yauba--perhaps even to Puerto Rico.

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  18. I agree with Elvin that the last 2 paragraphs are a a resolution and climax and the two main characters are moving towards what they actually want.

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  19. husband is feeling or expressing.

    *I disagree that Pedro is a main character, the only thing that is noted about Pedro is his physical and mental differences compared to Yauba. Since he is the "ideal macho man image" yet is abusive compared to Yuaba who is kind, gentle and never talks to Rosa when he is angry. Who does not have the macho man image and is very skinny. I do believe Pedro is used as Rosa's use of having a moral compass in not leaving her husband and the fact that she has stayed with him trying to take a hold of his culture when in fact her lack of knowledge is being used against her.

    *Since Pedro isn't a third character being nothing but a dominant thought to the main character, I'd say the narration would change to an alternating first person narration. 

    *There are 3 plots to the story, the conflict of an abusive relationship between Rosa and Pedro along with her considering going back home. Yauba and his conflict with his job or not being given the rights and dues he deserves for being overworked and underpaid; Yet he's afraid to speak up since he can be replaced by three immigrants instead. Thirdly the plot between Yauba and Rosa and their affair and "love triangle."

    * The flashback or Yauba's situation with his job. His past of living in Puerto Rico and having his aunt Celina raise him as he shares his past with Rosa; It shows how he worked hard and is still working hard to own his own restaurant. Along with Rosa remembering the past of growing up with her parents not showing her anything about her culture and secretly listening to spanish music and speaking in their native tongue when they believed she was asleep; Asking her husband to explain phrases in spanish and he'll ridicule or mock her for not knowing. Even though she's trying to find out their meaning by asking and confiding in him to have an understanding of Puerto Rico and to not feeling like an outsider and in a sense being a New Yorican by having a more american background and having no understanding of a country she's curious about.


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  20. Jamie, I think your detailed analysis of the impact of flashback is especially useful.

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  21. In regards to question 5 I would have to agree with a few of my other classmates with them saying that the last couple of paragraphs present both a resolution and a climax.There was definitely a resolution between Rosa and Yauba with their “love connection” I think Rosa finally is able to come to a confirmation in knowing her love for Yauba is true and shes able to express that she wants to be with him despite her having mixed feeling before.I also say there is a climax in the last few paragraphs because a climax in a story is a turning point in which readers emotional response reaches a peak and I think we all can agree that we were all left with mixed feelings and questions wondering what will Rosa do next, where does her and Pedro's relationship stand ? will she get the courage to leave him ? and will she and Yauba finally be together without her marriage being in the way ?
    - Kaniya White

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    1. This makes sense, Kaniya, if we call it a resolution of one main issue but not all possible issues.

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  22. The story leaves off on a cliff hanger or a question, of what is to become of Yuaba and Rosa relationship? Even though they found peace in their fantasies of later getting a life together and escaping their troubles, what if they have t come to a tough realization its just fantasy and they cant escape

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  23. George, I think that you are arguing against the idea that the story has a resolution. The class so far is very divided on this issue, and you can see from Kaniya's post right above yours that she is taking the opposite view. I think a good case can be made for your position AND for hers, because interpreters can legitimately define "resolution" differently.

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  24. goodmorning professor, i have no questions on essay 1

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  25. Good Morning Professor,
    No questions about today's blog and Thank you.

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